Turning ‘Combat Casualties’ into ‘Victims’ & Vice Versa

Curious Terminology Game in the US Media

VictimLast Friday as I was searching the headlines for noteworthy and interesting news articles I came across a fairly lengthy and detailed story on Humam Khalil Abu-Mulal al-Balawi. Considering the saturated state of this recent CIA slaying story and the reporting source, I almost skipped the article, but then, something caught my eye; something easy to miss with the naked eye, at least those of gullible US Media readers-believers. It wasn’t the story itself, nor was it the flowery details in an attempt to make it a possible future ‘Hollywood Action Drama’ worthy of a six figure movie rights offer. It also wasn’t due to the authors, since neither one of them was familiar to me. No, it was none of that. What caught my attention and held it there for the next few hours was the very calculative and selective usage of a word in the title; Victim:

“In Afghanistan attack, CIA fell victim to series of miscalculations about informant”

With that word, victim, in mind, I quickly checked a few other media sites, and sure enough the word was there. I will give you a couple of quick examples, starting with NY Daily News:

Among the CIA victims, including several contractors, was a mother of three who directed operations and intelligence gathering at Forward Operating Base Chapman, a secretive site in Khowst province on the Pakistan border that also houses a State Department reconstruction team.

An eighth American victim was a State Department worker. An Afghan also was killed in the attack and six other Americans were wounded.

And the next excerpt from the so-called lefty PBS:

Families of some of the CIA victims have released information about their lives. Harold Brown Jr., 37, from Massachusetts, had a wife and three children; Jeremy Wise, 35, was a former Navy SEAL and worked as a security contractor; Scott Michael Roberson, 39, worked as a security officer and had a wife who was eight months pregnant; and Dane Clak Paresi, 46, was a contractor and retired soldier.

First, let’s get the very simple facts straight here:

These were not some CIA paper pushers in some office building overseas, nor were they the stereotyped useless undercover social butterflies hanging out in embassies’ cocktail parties. These were the other breed: Combatants in the so-called war zone, actually in the heart of the combat zone, engaged in combat involving the deadliest of attacks using unmanned drones. As for the other two Blackwater contractors, I don’t have to tell you what they do. Do I?

With our military guys who get killed in wars, this same media reports using words such as combat casualties, killed, slain… Please be my guest and comb through the unfortunately plentiful reports on US military casualties. In fact here is the straight forward definition of casualty by the military:

A casualty is a member of personnel unable to fulfill their duties within a military organization due to death or incapacitation by injury or illness.

And here is how it is defined by encyclopedia

A hostile casualty is any person who is killed in action or wounded by any civilian, paramilitary, terrorist, or military force that may or may not represent a nation or state. Also included in this classification are persons killed or wounded accidentally either by friendly fire or by fratricide, which occurs when troops are mistakenly thought to be an enemy force.

As for general usage of Victims of War, this is what usually is meant:

…to those who may be described as the victims of war-that is, noncombatant civilians and those no longer able to take part in hostilities.

I know what you are thinking; kind of. Why split hairs over some terminology usage that may or may not have been calculated, selected, and then given to the public by the media.  And, that’s exactly why I ended up spending several hours researching after coming across that article by the Washington Post.

I spent a few hours combing through the Washington Post archives. I am sure I wasn’t able to check hundreds of their semi-fiction reportage, but I’d say dozens of articles should suffice to establish selective usage of the word victim when it hardly applies, and never using the word where it would be 100% correct and applicable.

Wouldn’t you, or almost anyone, even those with only a minute trace of comprehension-knowledge-brain-common sense, consider the civilian casualties, when it’s comprised of babies, toddlers, grandmothers, as victims of war? As victims? Every dictionary, encyclopedia, and everyone with certified expertise in the English language, would say ‘YES.’

Then how is it that when reporting on established, 100% confirmed, civilian casualties of US combat attacks that include innocent children, this same Washington Post does not use the word victim; not even once? Not in relation to the family members of those children and mothers killed; as in “…the uncle of one of the victims…’ or something like ‘these children fell victim to inaccurate…’ I could go on and list dozens of links from past articles on major heart wrenching civilian casualties of our senseless and perpetual war(s), and show you the absence of the word victim in all. Or you can easily do that yourself: visit Washington Post, enter the key words ‘Afghanistan civilian casualties war’ in the box, click on search, comb through tens if not hundreds of resultant articles on civilian casualties of our war, and look for the word ‘victim.’


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  1. Main Entry: collateral damage
    Function: noun
    Date: 1972
    : injury inflicted on something other than an intended target; specifically : civilian casualties of a military operation.

    Sibel I do not wonder why you might spend hours on researching the usage of the word ‘victim’.

    I do the same kinds of things myself and get quite an education in the process. I unfortunately do not have a forum to point out these subliminals. Or in this case, propaganda.

    2 : the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person
    3 : ideas, facts, or allegations spread deliberately to further one’s cause or to damage an opposing cause; also : a public action having such an effect.

    And the MSM print and media are full of both. Thanks for pointing out the ‘victimization’ of our War Machine.

  2. frog-o-matic says:

    Thank you, Sibel, excellent post!!!

  3. contextofnocontext says:


    I certainly agree with your larger point. Whether it’s planned or inadvertent (though more and more we can see the explicit strategies of propagandists like Mr. Sunstein in action) there has been, for a long time, a clear de-emphasis on, to paraphrase George W.S. Trow, the powerful actions of certain people (be they deep state actors or simply the acknowledged decision-makers). Instead everything is described with the terms of choice and preference. In other words, Demography. You can see this rather vacuous ideology in even the smartest of individuals. The language of marketing and polling has been foisted on them as though it represents the non-partisan approach, the route of the expert.

    To me, it’s for this reason that so many people who do follow the news and do care about freedom and justice (abstractly at least) still can’t bring themselves to believe, as ridiculous as this sounds, that events are caused by the actions of certain powerful individuals. You’ll notice that this concept is part of Mr. Sunstein’s definition of a dangerous anti-government conspiracy theorist. This is a very basic but worrying conceptual shift, something that Mr. Trow in the book that is my namesake here, was describing back in 1979.

    The ensuing cognitive dissonance from this attack on concepts and language (word virus, whathaveyou) leads to something pretty close to Orwell’s Doublethink. Ex) These people are supposed to be experts in their field, they have all the information, they have the wiretaps and the warnings and the funding and the technology – yet they are perennial victims of bureaucracy and institutional incompetence that shockingly results in the implementation of previously stated Grand Chessboard strategies.

    Wait, I forgot: We’re all victims, it’s a victim society. Coincidence is everywhere. So we, as victims/slaves, wait for the next event and the instructions on how to react to it. And like good victims/slaves, we’re told to Hope for the best.

    All that to say this has everything to do with language. No wonder Sunstein wants to re-institute CO-INTEL-PRO primarily online. No wonder the IDF has civilians heavily “Troll”-ing blogs and websites in the wake of Cast Lead, either defending Israel or trying to radicalize the discussion with Jew-baiting clap-trap.

    It’s an oblique lexicon for an oblique conflict. Keep up the great work.

  4. cinderman says:

    It’s just part and parcel of the methodical brainwashing of the American public. Twist the vocabulary a little, and then whamo, our warring forces are then “victims” of their own aggression for domination of the world’s “resources” – another ambiguous term in itself.

  5. @contextofnocontext: Another deep and well-written comment from you; thank you. How have you been, and what’s the status of your upcoming forum/blog? Feel free to contact me directly, and let me know if you’s be interested in publishing here while working on your future site.

    @TrueOil: Paul Jamiol and I were discussing exactly that: the notion of Collateral Damage; great minds think alike:-)Thanks for the comment and the relevant definitions.

    @Frog-O-Matic: I think this is your first comment here; otherwise I would have remembered the cool screen name-complimentary to our site:-) Welcome, and hope to have many more comments from you.

  6. Definitions are being changed. from the inside of a very dirty war.
    Its called Perception Management. A program initiated in the early stages of the war, just after false flag 911.
    Reading a ‘conspiracy theorists’ handbook by cass Sunstein [Harvard Law Nadir] should help all understand the complexities of “you are either with us; or you are with the terrorist”.

  7. camusrebel says:

    Context, I also right away thought Orwell. The WaPo has a long history of playing the Mockingbird game. The Graham family goes back to playing footsie with the pre CIA OSS spooks. Words matter.

    You are correct Remo….none of this is by chance or accident

    One could, I suppose, imagine a WaPo reporter feeling like, “of course I will use the word victim for a CO-WORKER”

    Sibel, nice job summing up in a short piece the whole crux of whats wrong in our print media. What gets me is how some can still call ANY mainstream paper, but especially that fishwrapper, liberal. People actually still call the NYT and Post pillars of the “Liberal Media”. Freakin’ hilarious. We have our work cut out for us.

  8. @Cinderman: well-said. And, ‘ambiguous’ indeed.

    @Remo: ‘Perception Management’- And maybe as applicable: ‘Psychological Warfare at Home Front.’

    @Camusrebel: Right on. Although I don’t know those two WP reporters)??!), my bet: They started off as our dirt bag, Walter Pincus’interns, and now they operate under him. As you know CIA/Blackwater happen to be Pincus’ area at Wash Post…And of course, you know Pincus’ established CV and his CIA credentials;-)


    I have to tell you: I am getting so tired of not being able to respond directly to each comment directly, and having to use ‘@ this’ and ‘@ that.’ And I’m sure you are as sick of it as I am! We tried to plug in that function (in fact twice), and that ended up messing up a bunch of other site functions. Part of it: due to this new Word Press AKismet function…and of course, the bigger part: our very very limited tech/web skills. I asked Santa for enough funds to hire a part-time savvy web admnistrator. He missed the Christmas deadline, NY Day, and my birthday yesterday…I’m still waiting!!!SOS.

  9. Kingfisher says:

    “No wonder the IDF has civilians heavily “Troll”-ing blogs and websites in the wake of Cast Lead, either defending Israel or trying to radicalize the discussion with Jew-baiting clap-trap.”


  10. Thank you for taking a personal horror story and using it to wake up the complacent masses of victims of the Economic Terrorism and Physical Terrorism perpetrated under the fear-based control model. The news broadcasters are ultimately owned by a few elite, confiscating middle class wealth, purposely manipulating by selecting what the masses get to learn as “news”. They are also the ones who control what music gets played, what businesses get favorable laws, etc.

    The propaganda of war is designed to separate the masses into various “Us” vs. “Them” categories like “democrats” vs. “republicans”, so we blame “them” for our problems and thereby permitting things like the UnPatriotic Act, Presidential dictatorship, use of torture to “protect the American life style” – so the elite can destroy the middle class and create a literal 21st Century Wage-Slave state.

    I was one of the sleeping masses till about a year ago. After doing a little investigating, I realized that the middle class is becoming victims of an economic war we didn’t realize we were playing. Then I wrote songs called “Incite Social Evolution” and “Fiat Greed”, calling for every day people become part of the solution – like Sibel is doing. Listen FREE 24/7 @ http://www.SassyAlternativeMusic.com/Downloads & spread the word.

  11. Good to hear of you again. That seemed pretty heroic what you did.

    On the words issue in the news: VICTIM,
    The established press handles the reporting on… all that is fit to print, and most of that we get is what they do. So the way the words are used is pretty important.
    Anybody who writes will develop some amount of personal style as a rule, and can sometimes be identified by it. The favorite words come out, certain turns of phrases much less the angle or particular aspects that writer may be known to dwell on a lot.
    But in a lot of news reporting there are words that seem to jump to conclusions, we may take notice of it sometimes, because these words are used a little too often, and across the field. Everybody uses them. Terms, that are connotative of judgement, and suggest a response. Victim: A victim is a recipient of a bad event. Like a child is injured, (we should be concerned. )
    We are moved to identify with the subject.
    There is a whole raft of these “buzz words” and turns of speech. but that’s just the way it is. So in reading, weigh the value of the product, by considering the way it is crafted, and whether information is offered up with out instructions.

  12. ‘Victims’ indeed. Aren’t these the very same people implicated in numerous civilian deaths including children??

  13. @tudevoxRo: “The propaganda of war is designed to separate the masses into various “Us” vs. “Them” categories like “democrats” vs. “republicans”” Exactly; thanks for pointing this out, and ‘dem vs. rep.’ is a perfect example.

    @joetoad: I agree with you, and support your adv.”weigh the value of the product, by considering the way it is crafted, and whether information is offered up with out instructions.” The problem is: getting the majority do just that. As you can see, you and I, and the rest of our irate minority members here, are already doing that. And the rest, the so-called majority, happen to be watching, listening to, and reading, thus, having their outlook/view/knowledge shaped by the propoganda machine…

    @Laudyms: “Aren’t these the very same people implicated in numerous civilian deaths including children??” Bingo! Don’t take me wrong, I feel sorry for their loved ones/children/family/etc. BUT these people happen to be the ones engaged in Black Operations, paid by Black Budget…and those who were willing to engage in these types of operations for hefty 6 figure salaries-BLACKWATER, well, let’s put it this way: they are far from being ‘victims.’

  14. camusrebel says:

    yes, i admit, i work for IDF. good ol’ punkfisher, can’t sneak a thing by him. Any diseased reptile slimy and soulless enough to think the crushing to death of Rachel Corrie was just a marvelous thing most likely does not even understand irony enough to explain how when the pot calls the kettle black, everyone knows the pot just admitted he was either semi-retarded or delusional.

  15. cinderman says:

    Sibel… it’s nice to have your comments on comments. It’s very hospitable of you and it will keep people like me coming back. Keep up the good work!

  16. Nice pickup on the “victim” term here and how the mainstream media have tried to frame the story of these armchair killers as brave freedom fighters. Imagine the terror of the mother in the house in Waziristan with her two young children when they suddenly hear the roar of the drone overhead and then the firing of the missile . . . yet when news of the event reaches the 12th page of a mainstream publication, the report will likely state that suspected “terrorists” were killed. Since the adolescent became president in 2000, it is incredible how the government, with the help of those in the media as you cited, have misappropriated our language in order to serve their own ends. People in Iraq who defended themselves against the United States’ unlawful invasion of their country are “insurgents” and “militants”. In Boston 235 years ago, such people were called patriots. Black is white, up is down, and we have a Republican Senator taking Ted Kennedy’s seat.

  17. Hi Sibel,

    Good for you for posting this.

    But now you could extend this further(in the sense of civilians being killed or barely surviving).

    If they do survive, consider the long-term effects of this trauma on them. With all of the govt. contractors in Iraq and Afghanistan, has anyone (including the military) ever treated any civilians for PTSD? Many vets are too ashamed to admit they have a problem. If they do try to get help, they get no support whatsoever.

    What about the civilians? Correct me if I’m wrong. But in many other countries, “mental illness” is a sign of weakness? If that’s true, how then are these people supposed to get help without being labeled by others? Because of what the U.S. and other countries did to them.

    Keep in mind there is no cure for PTSD. If little kids are traumatized, in some cases it can acutally alter their brain chemistry. Untreated trauma is energy trapped in your body. If it’s not treated, you can have adrenalin surges that make your body feel like a pinball machine. Add to that, dissociaitng, lucid dreams, PTSD blackouts and other symptoms.

    And if that’s not bad enough, to then possibly be ignored by literally everyone around you. But that doesn’t conveniently fit into a soundbite on (fill in the blank with a MSM talk show).

    Ask almost any PTSD survivor. And one thing that they really hate is being treated like a political football so some politician who allegedly “cares” gets re-elected.

    Have you ever seen a Congressional hearing with a civilian trauma survivor with PTSD? I haven’t.

  18. JamesLaffrey says:

    Fine post, Sibel. And some of the comments are admirable, too.

    I’d like to contribute in the following way. You wrote:
    “I know what you are thinking; kind of. Why split hairs over some terminology usage that may or may not have been calculated, selected, and then given to the public by the media.”

    MAY or MAY NOT. No, we can erase all reasonable doubt. There is no doubt. Their usage is calculated. Rarities can be explained as accidents, but the pattern of misuse of words is proof of calculation. How do I know?

    I went to journalism school. The profs were very clear about such words. They had us write news stories using these important words correctly. And they had us critique new stories in newspapers. Of course, not every student got an “A” in j school. But then they got their first job at a small newspaper, and if they didn’t already understand the distinctions between and among important words, their editor(s) schooled ’em on the spot. Later, they “qualified” for and landed a job at a big and famous newspaper. There, the occasional mistake slips by under the stress of deadlines. But in general, stories in big newspapers are:
    – written by reporter-writers who know the meanings of the words
    – read and edited by each reporters’ department editor, who knows the meanings of the words
    – read and edited by a copy editor (copy editors are often walking dictionaries who can cite not only dictionary entries but also specifics in their own newspaper’s very strict Stylebook, which every big newspaper provides for in-house use only)
    – and then the stories are published.

    The big newspapers’ use of words such as “victim” and “casualty” are a result of company policy, whether that policy is written or unwritten.

    Yes, in the context of major newspapers, my use of the word “company” can be read as both “newspaper company” and CIA.

  19. and in this world of word war, e x p l o s i o n becomes c o l l a p s e .

  20. Kingfisher says:

    “Any diseased reptile slimy and….”
    More Jew baiting? The Jews are reptiles; David Icke stuff in the Ronson book, right?

    “..soulless enough to think the crushing to death of Rachel Corrie was just a marvelous thing most likely does”
    You are consumed with Rachel Corrie, and have brought her up several times without provocation in unrelated conversations. What is she a talking point on some troll-provocateur crib sheet or something?

  21. Kingfisher says:


    Your concern about PTSD and civilians in the region is admirable. However, there are more pressing health issues in Afghanistan and Western Pakistan than PTSD; like the need for frontline humanitarian assistance and basic infrastructure, and matters of public health. The reality of it is that these people are prone to traumatic events in their way of life regardless of the USA, and they are far more resilient then you or I ever could be.


  22. Kingfisher says:

    “As for the other two Blackwater contractors, I don’t have to tell you what they do. Do I?”
    Provide security and paramilitary support to agency case officers?

    “BUT these people happen to be the ones engaged in Black Operations,”
    And aren’t you friends with people who worked black ops, Sibel? What do you think Russ Tice or Tony Shaffer did in their careers?

    “paid by Black Budget…”
    Black budget is mostly r&d. Pretty sure they are paid from CIA operations funds via a prime contractor.

    “and those who were willing to engage in these types of operations for hefty 6 figure salaries-BLACKWATER,”
    They were also willing to engage in these types of operations for 15-20 years being paid the paltry sums we pay our enlisted men who serve our country. As contractors they also get no pension from BW or CIA; and probably pay out of pocket for health and liability insurance.

    “well, let’s put it this way: they are far from being ‘victims.’”
    They were victims of a suicide bomber attack and a series of miscalculations by CIA about an informant. Which is the context the word ‘victim’ was used – not in some lefty pathology way.

  23. ‘serving our country’. thats a context thing too, right?. what part of ‘our’ country do you reckon they serve? context covers a multitude of sin. like serving our country. covers a multitude of sin.

  24. camusrebel says:

    Poor, poor punkfisher. Yes, I will continue to bring up how much glee and joyous rapture you gleened from the bulldozer crushing to death that heroic young lady. You want people to forget how wonderful you said that abomination was? I’m so sorry, it aint gonna happen. You made your bed with putrid, fetid, rancid sheets….enjoy your beauty rest precious.

    If it makes you cry, maybe you can have that studly IDF’er who so courageously ran over Rachel cuddle you, whispering aipac-ish sweet nothings about the chosen people.

  25. On the run so here is a quick response:

    @KF: your comment re: payment structure for BW thugs-misleading; false. Why do you think BW successfully recruits from CIA/DOD? They dangle much higher salary + hefty life insurance among other benefits (of course paid fully by US taxpayers). As for your comment on Tice, Shaffer and others I know well: EXACTLY; so I know what I’m talking about here;-) Tice would/does consider the latest BOs simply despicable. As for Schaffer and others: they had plenty to say, and I had plenty to learn from their experiences. And a few others I know: they retired-one of them is working for a very shady Casino owner overseas and deals in sh..(because that’s who he is); another one is a bodyguard to a man who happens to be ‘Most Wanted’ in Europe for Heroin dealings.This is what one of them said to me: when they recruit and assign us they look for the following qualities/background: “Broken home and abusive parents background, pathological lying tendencies, sadistic disposition, ability to con….These qualifications are necessary for the black tasks to be performed.”

    Well, it’s a shame they took out Ted Bundy. He would have made a perfect Black Op. guy, BlackWater contractor; he met all the qualifications.

    As for the usage of word ‘Victim’: Say you are right, then how come that word is not being used even once for 1000s of war victims, civilian deaths…by these same publications/reporters?

    I must tell you: you’ve been given tons of misinformation, false info and good ole brainwashing by our establishment’s propaganda machine. Well, it’s sad but also eye opening to see how the other side thinks or not able to really think.

  26. In this context, a victim is someone who is cut down by a sociopath/serial killer, not an enemy combatant. We are not allowed by the government, and therefor the MSM, to see the suicide bomber as a legitimate fighter, but rather as an evil being whose only goal is to create havoc and maim out of some perverse religious fervor. If we consider suicide bombers as soldiers, we might start to wonder why they use that particular tactic, and wonder what could drive human beings to destroy themselves just for the chance to take out a few of their adversaries. We are not allowed to think of them as human beings for fear that we might begin to empathize with our enemies.

    As for civilian casualties in the middle east, they do not count as they are not considered human. The are just faceless androids who happen to live near our targets so they are guilty by geography; but justification is not really necessary when you destroy a non-human.

    Or at least that is the perception we get from the MSM reporting.

    I bet the US public would see things differently if we used a missile to kill a drug dealer in New York and destroyed a day-care center in the process. I bet we would hear stories about every kid in that place, and about their families, and all of the day-care workers as well. It would be a national tragedy that could lead to rioting, massive lawsuits and criminal prosecution against those who pulled the trigger. But that is only because those kids would be portrayed like us: human.

  27. 344thBrother says:

    Hi Sibel
    As you well know, it’s been reekingly obvious for a long time that the “Main Stream Media” has engaged in word play, minimizing, trivialization, under reportage, slanting, (Insert your adjective here) for the propagandization of the Israel Palestine conflict as well. (Today is my day for alternative adjectives) 😀

    I took a few minutes and ran a gross preliminary analysis on the WWW use of the terms “Palestine Victim” and “Israel Victim”.

    I went to 12 total search engines: Google, Yahoo, Ixquick, Alta Vista, Bing, Ask, Wikipedia, Lycos, AOL, Excite, MSN and Gigablast, and just looked at the numbers of hits each search returned. Here are the results as they stand so far with no massaging for all the obvious variables I’m currently ignoring. (I’m supposed to be working). 😛

    Total Search Results for Palestine Victim 44,700,091
    Total Search Results for Israel Victim 156,335,265

    So for every search hit on Palestine Victim, there were 3.497 hits for Israel Victim.

    There’s zero bias in my reportage of this, it’s a straight compilation of the results that came up for those search terms. Admittedly there’s a fair amount of data corruption due to all the wars Israel has conducted versus the Palestine conflict, ((Which obviously created more “Israel Victims”). Over the next few days, I will continue to “Boil” down this mess to try and figure out based on the best data I can find, the actual number of Israeli war deaths versus the number of Palestinian deaths and factor in the use of the word “Victim”. So far this data has been difficult to find, but I’m on the case. If you have any suggestions on the actual numbers, feel free to join in.

    Bottom line at this preliminary “Juncture”, There are a LOT more Israeli Victims of the Israel/Palestine conflict because that’s the way it’s reported, so it must be true!

    Thank you once again for exercising my mind and my skepticism.
    Peace on earth
    Dave Short

  28. 344thBrother says:

    Weird side note on the above:

    I Just searched Google for the term “Victim” with no modifiers.

    Results 1 – 10 of about 58,100,000 for Victim [definition]. (0.30 seconds)
    Results 1 – 10 of about 6,780,000 for Israel Victim. (0.31 seconds)

    So, every 8.569 times the word “Victim” is used, it relates in some way to Israel. How many people are there in that country anyway?

    Israel must be the most victimized country in the known Universe!

    HAHAH so weird.

    peace on earth
    God bless the little children
    Dave Short

  29. @344thBrother:Excellent Illustration! Now, let’s take that ratio, 1 to 3.4, and add to that the ratio of Palestenian civilian death to Israeli civilian death. I don’t remember that exact number but was at least 50 to 1. Now, plug in this ratio to the result you got from your Google search. Telling, isn’t it?! Many many thanks for sharing this perfect example…

    @Bara:”As for civilian casualties in the middle east, they do not count as they are not considered human. The are just faceless androids who happen to live near our targets so they are guilty by geography; but justification is not really necessary when you destroy a non-human.” Very true. This same point applied to others as well. Remember Vietnam: their 1.5 million+ did not count; did not matter. Same with your last example/context:
    “I bet the US public would see things differently if we used a missile to kill a drug dealer in New York and destroyed a day-care center in the process. I bet we would hear stories about every kid in that place, and about their families, and all of the day-care workers as well. It would be a national tragedy that could lead to rioting, massive lawsuits and criminal prosecution against those who pulled the trigger. But that is only because those kids would be portrayed like us: human.”
    Right on.

    I have to say: I truly am proud of our irate minority club members here. Considering all the bleak realities, situations, we are facing, this gives me hope. It should give us all hope. And I don’t mean to sound cheesy. At least for me, most of the times I feel very pessimistic, grim, and find it easy to say ‘what’s the point. No one else seem to really register or care…maybe something is seriously wrong/off with me…’ Well, reading these comments and e-mail responses, I don’t feel alone.

  30. 344thBrother says:

    Thank you for your kind words Sibel:

    We all feel isolated at times. I am fortunate in that I began yelling about this kind of stuff at my family back… 25 years ago or so, and they HATED it. But they did learn. They’re grown now and they still hate to hear about it, but they no longer revolt or argue mindlessly.

    My son recently told me during one of these sessions that I should feel good, that he’s woken up everyone he knows (Over 40 people so far) and they all have friends and families. This is something I did not see and would not have believed before he told me.

    So, you are far far from alone, you and I and the other frogs here are just among the relatively few who are driven to speak out on it, and who coincidentally have time and the interest and lets face it, the guts, to do so.

    However those who know enough to be concerned are working quietly, boiling away in the pot, thinking about how to jump out without landing on the burner. Based on the results of Copenhagen, the Health Care Bill, and all the other failed Obama efforts, it looks to me like the frogs vastly outnumber the bad guys. (The uninformed and TV heads still have us beat, but they’re catching on)

    And then there are people like Luke Rudkowski and the “Love Police” who are taking it to the streets and straight in the faces of the enemy. When I start to feel bad, I watch some of the videos at http://www.Wearechange.org or I read some of what you and the other frogs have to say, and like you, I no longer feel alone.

    God bless us every one
    Especially your beautiful little girl

  31. boo

  32. 344thBrother says:

    Bara you posted:

    “I bet the US public would see things differently if we used a missile to kill a drug dealer in New York and destroyed a day-care center in the process. I bet we would hear stories about every kid in that place, and about their families, and all of the day-care workers as well. It would be a national tragedy that could lead to rioting, massive lawsuits and criminal prosecution against those who pulled the trigger. But that is only because those kids would be portrayed like us: human.”
    Right on.

    HELL yeah.

  33. there’s something fishy going on with this site’s software.

  34. If you know as much about these people as I think most people on this site do, then it’s obvious that it is a coordinated strategy.

    Freakin scumbags and their petty little interests ruining millions of lives; criminals which need serious punishing.

  35. 344thBrother says:

    My Name is Dave Short
    I live in Salyer, Northern California
    I’m a researcher and I don’t give a DAMN if the spies and toadies know who I am or where I am. In fact, I want them to know, and to know that I’m not afraid.

    zaknick, what’s your point? Do you really think you have some form of anonymity on the web? What do you think is going on with the site?


  36. “In Wars for Souls, Profits are in casualties.”


    None of this is new to Native people here. Go back 150 years and substitute “battle” and “massacre” for search terms. Every successful Native victory over whites was a “massacre”. Every slaughter of native people was a “battle”. But the image of the enemy as bloodthirsty-irrational-savage remains the same.

    Re: The Khost attack. Let’s rewrite the headline in clearer terms:

    “Taliban Successfully Infiltrates and Destroys Drone Attack Base. Covert CIA Spooks and Contract Mercenaries Among The Dead.”

    I have gotten a few snarky comments on other boards when I pointed out that it was the fourth successful Taliban attack against Afghani, Pakistani, American and Jordanian intelligence assets in the past 6 months. My conclusion from that was the Taliban were winning the intel war there.

    The thing that scares this group the most is the image of the suicide bomber. It ties in with the memories of the Kamikaze in World War 2:

    Victory at Sea: Suicide For Glory

    Remember, it was the Divine Wind and it’s implications for the Invasion of Japan that led to the use of nuclear weapons.

  37. ZicaTanka says:
  38. 344thBrother says:

    I followed your link back to the originating video clip that is available on Ron Paul’s “Daily Paul” website under “We should take out the CIA”

    Here’s the link: http://www.dailypaul.com/node/121958

    The quote is posted there with a video clip that only works occasionally.

    Here’s the complete quote from the web site and I agree with the intent of the speech, although I disagree with his purported use of the phrase “Take out” because of the potential for spin that Ron Paul is calling for violence against the CIA.

    The timing on this is very odd. This on the heals of Glen Beck claiming that 911 Truth is a threat to the president’s life, in the White House no less. It would be funny if it wasn’t so criminal and stupid and dangerous. I pasted a link to Beck’s statement below.
    Ron Paul: “We need to take out the CIA!”
    Submitted by Michael Nystrom on Tue, 01/19/2010 – 21:06
    * Daily Paul Liberty Forum
    Excerpt from the Campaign for Liberty Regional Conference in Atlanta, GA. As the crowd begins to cheer, Ron Paul states, “We need to take out the CIA!” (YES HE DOES SAY THAT)

    There’s been a coup – have you heard? It’s the CIA coup. The CIA runs everything! They run the military .. and they’re every bit as secretive as the Federal Reserve. And yet, think of the harm they have done since they were established at the end of World War II. They are a government unto themselves. They’re in businesses, in drug businesses, they take out dictators… We need to take out the CIA!

    Rereading now this “quote” refers to the CIA taking out dictators… again appearing to reference violent actions and then right after that is “We need to take out the CIA”.

    OK I finally got the video clip to play. It’s pretty accurate to what was posted above the video. Ron Paul is usually more careful about his use of English. It appears that he feels passionately about this issue, and that he got carried away, because after all, what threat can Ron Paul and his movement really pose to them?
    Here’s a clip of Glen Beck on his Radio show saying:
    “Watch the uber-left, pray that Obama moves to the center, if he does, pray that the Secret Service care for that man, that that man is never left alone. He has invited 911 TRUTHERS into the White House and into his administration, if they believe he’s just another one of these guys he is in danger.”


    The meaning of this idiocy is vague, perhaps there’s previous stupidity from him that provides context, but his intent is clear. Beck is claiming that Obama needs special protection from 911 Truthers in the White House. How ridiculous is that?!


    Sibel, you’re a member of 911 Truth, as are we all probably, how do you feel about this blatant, dangerous lie? Would you consider returning to the Alex Jones show and throwing in with him in attacking Beck for this slander? It would probably help advertise your excellent site and perhaps result in some much needed funds as well, but regardless, this type of slander must be answered whenever possible in my humble opinion.

    Here’s Jones on his TV show addressing Becks statement.


    I am in FULL agreement with Alex on this. I think there needs to be a very loud and concerted effort to take Beck down about 5 pegs on this subject. If it’s allowed to stand or God forbid gain steam, 911 Truth’s excellent image of strict non violence will be severely damaged.

    peace on earth.
    You know Glen… PEACE?
    Dave Short

  39. 344thBrother says:

    Ishmael you posted:
    “Remember, it was the Divine Wind and it’s implications for the Invasion of Japan that led to the use of nuclear weapons.”

    I agree in principal with most of your post above. Bringing the “Insurgents” into the military in Iraq sure worked out well for the “Intelligence” people didn’t it? Frankly I don’t think the people at the top WANT to win they just want it to keep going. Like Vietnam, Korea, the Cold War etc. . There’s lots more money to be had.

    Regarding Divine Wind though, I disagree. My understanding is that by the time the Kamikaze attacks got going, Japan was on its knees. Their fleet was blown up, their aircraft were in poor repair and their pilots were largely inexperienced. I think a good representation of this was the movie “Empire of the Sun”.

    According to the history that I’ve read, the nuclear bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima was more about declaring the USA as the ULTIMATE winners of WW2 and not about any real fear that existed of casualties or defeat. Since when did the administration give a DAMN about casualties among our service men?

    We had the bomb, nobody else did, we needed to prove it. We had air bases on the islands near Japan. The whole “Looming Invasion” of Japan was totally unnecessary and a cover for our uncalled-for nuclear attack. Japan knew they were done for. The people were starving. Their military industry had been leveled. The emperor was capitulating. We didn’t even need the bomb, we could have burned down the rest of Japan with incendiaries just like we did Tokyo.

    But hey, it made a great show didn’t it? Give ’em hell Harry! In his statement about the bombing of Hiroshima, Truman gave short shrift to the dangers of an invasion and focused almost entirely on the power of the Atomic Bomb.

    Harry S. Truman “We are now prepared to obliterate more rapidly and completely every productive enterprise the Japanese have above ground in any city. We shall destroy their docks, their factories, and their communications.” Key phrase, “More rapidly and completely”. Their docks, factories and communications were already compromised or destroyed. It was a slick piece of propaganda that has held up to this day.

    Oh yeah and it also allowed Harry Truman to usher in the National Security Act of 1947 which made the President the ultimate dictator of what could be kept secret from the American People. Covert wars, drug running, massive scandals etc. . followed as surely as night follows day.

    In my opinion that Act was the beginning of the end for privacy and freedom in this country. It is only real reason that the office of the Presidency is so important to the organized crime families who now run the country covertly as the “Shadow Government”. Up until the dropping of the Atomic Bomb there was no such thing as “National Security”. How convenient.

    When you can declare “KINGS X” on anything you like, how long do you suppose it will take for people to start doing things they shouldn’t do and protecting themselves under “National Security”? Pretty good, two lies in two words. It’s sure not for our Nation and it definitely doesn’t make us more secure, it probably never has nor was it intended to. It has protected spies from Israel who have stolen so many of our critical secrets and sold them to our enemies. It has prevented a real investigation into the attacks of 911. It’s allowed George Herbert Walker Bush to hide the records from his criminal administration. The damage this “Act” has done to our country is endless and even worse than the Patriot Act in my opinion.

    That’s my take on it, what’s yours?

    peace on earth
    Dave Short

  40. 344thBrother says:

    Am I a thread killer?

    Sorry for the flood off topic. Bad habit of picking up threads that aren’t on point and running with them. Too much coffee this morning too.


  41. My take on that Beck quote is that he was saying that if Obama is thought to be a 911 Truther (by association) he will be in “danger”, but, that’s me.

    Hi Sibel. Long time no see. Sorry I’ve been super busy. I’m a full time student again (twenty years since last time). You inspired me! 🙂 I like the new website. Keep up the good work. You are NOT alone!

  42. In other words, if the dark forces of the shadow government thought Obama was going to call for a new investigation into 911 or believe he has apparent sympathies for that cause (due to his hanging about with the 911 truther crowd), he would be in danger from the shadow government a la Kennedy. Not that he is somehow in danger of violence from 911 truthers in the whitehouse.

  43. PS – I came across this link on Wiki of all places footnoted under the entry for “plutocracy” which was at the end of a long string of wiki surfing (where I go looking for one thing and end up clicking connecting links to other pages for an hour or so). Kind of like going to the grocery store for bread and spending $100 on steaks, cookies, gourmet cheese, etc lol.

    I’m looking forward to finding this guys book(s) at the library.


    I know you don’t care for PBS, probably don’t like Bill Moyers either, but… 🙂

  44. @BillH: Many thanks for the link. I didn’t know about Kevin Phillips. I’d like to have him on our show; I’ll try.

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